Dijedon Senior Moderator
Posts: 9952
(8/5/07 1:55 pm)
Kosovar Albanians
I read some interesting quotes made by various anthropologists who visited Kosova and studied Kosovars. The quotes are in Albanian, so I'll be translating them to English. Nothing ambitious really since Kosova was never the subject of a large scale study. The first example is Glueck. He measured a number of Kosovars from Western Kosova 1895-96, and came up with these results;
Quote:Among these men, we detect that most are of tall stature (50 per cent) or medium stature (47 per cent). They have broad shoulders, round chests, muscular bodies, long hands and feet; the head is high, moderately broad and massive; the cephalic index is brachychephalic in most cases (60 per cent), but mesochephalc heads do occure as well (23 per cent). The face is long and moderately broad. The nose is leptorrhine (70 per cent) and straight in most cases (63 per cent). Mouth, lips and ears are of moderate size, the eyes are big and dark in 57 per cent of the cases, often with a ligt brown shade (40 per cent). Light eyes account for 43 per cent of the cases, of which grey eyes are the most common (30 per cent). Hair is dark to medium brown in 92 per cent of the cases.
During WWII, K.Dronchilov measured 112 Albanians from Kosova and W.Macedonia.
Quote:Their stature is often medium (48 per cent) and tall (38 per cent). The head is brachychephalic in 76 per cent of the cases, while mesochephalic heads account for 21 per cent. Faces are usually long and narrow (61 per cent), while mesoprosopic faces account for 27 per cent. The nose is straight and leptorrhine in 84 per cent of the cases. Hair is usually dark and medium brown (56 respectively 32 per cent), though there is also a high incidence of red or dark blonde hair with slight rufosity (11 per cent). Eyes are dark or dark-mixed in 57 per cent, though light-mixed/intermediate eyes are very frequent too (37 per cent). Skin color is milkish white when looked on the unexposed parts of the body (91 per cent).
Just to make everything clear, when these anthropologists say 'tall and medium stature', they said so in a time when humans were at an average shorter. Thus, tall stature in those times was, if I am not mistaken, somewhere between 1,75-80cm, while medium between 1,70-75 per cent. Short people, as is seen above, accounted for a small percentage among Kosovars. When compared to the neighbouring Serbs of the territories ajdacent to Kosova (Southern Serbia), Kosovars were six centimetres taller on average, lagging behind three centimetres in comparison to the Montenegrins.
Pittard was another anthropoligst who studied Kosovars during the first half of the 20th century. I could not find his conclusions on stature and other things, but in terms of pigmentation, he found out that most eyes were dark or dark-mixed (over 50 per cent), while 10 per cent had blue eyes and 23 per cent grey eyes.
A certain J.Chekanovski also commented on the noric/nordic influence among Albanians. He estimated they accounted for/was visible in 16 per cent among Albanians of Albania and 27,7 per cent among Albanians of Kosova.
Shqipėria ka qenė
dhe do tė jetė,
po sot nė ditėt tona
tė metė tė mos ketė.
E ka nderuar Zoti
gjithėnjė Shqipėrinė
ish fort mirė qėmoti,
do bėhet dhe taninė.
Naim Frashėri
Rcomplex78 Registered User
Posts: 47
(8/5/07 2:26 pm)
Re: Kosovar Albanians
Quote:When compared to the neighbouring Serbs of the territories ajdacent to Kosova (Southern Serbia), Kosovars were six centimetres taller on average
The difference seems a little extreme considering they are a neighbouring populace.
Dijedon Senior Moderator
Posts: 9956
(8/5/07 4:10 pm)
Re: Kosovar Albanians
I was surprised too. But note that these are the Serbs of Southern Serbia, namely the regions around cities such as Nis, Vranje, Prokuplje etc. Serbs of Western Serbia, Montenegro, Bosnia and Croatia rise significiantly in stature (Montenegrins being, probably, the tallest in Europe after the Dutch). Perhaps it's related to the mountainous nature of the dinaric mountain chain in W.Balkans !? It's known that Kosovar Albanians are descendants of highlanders who came from Northern Albania.
Quote:A certain J.Chekanovski also commented on the noric/nordic influence among Albanians. He estimated they accounted for/was visible in 16 per cent among Albanians of Albania and 27,7 per cent among Albanians of Kosova.
I have seen map of Chekanovski about balcan race...he noticed Kosova and West macedonia are most light skinned in balcan.
He same noticed little part of South Serbia and North Croatia.
hmm
I dont understand why Im so tall. My origin is entirely in south Albania with very very minimal central Albanian mixture. Yet Im nearly 2 meters(6'5).
The average in my family is 6 feet. South Albanians are not tall... it does not make sense.
Novi Pazar Commanding Moderator
Posts: 7312
(8/7/07 4:06 am)
Re: MD
"I dont understand why Im so tall. My origin is entirely in south Albania with very very minimal central Albanian mixture. Yet Im nearly 2 meters(6'5)."
Meltdown, the chinese are short and look at yao ming.
The only way to make sure people you agree with can speak is to support the rights of people you don't agree with
Quote:I have seen map of Chekanovski about balcan race...he noticed Kosova and West macedonia are most light skinned in balcan.
I agree, also the Malsors are light skinned...but I think in kosova and macedonia the climate is different from the other places
Dijedon Senior Moderator
Posts: 9978
(8/7/07 2:11 pm)
Re: hmm
Quote:I dont understand why Im so tall. My origin is entirely in south Albania with very very minimal central Albanian mixture. Yet Im nearly 2 meters(6'5).
Well, it does not matter. I think short stature in South Albania is an exaggerated stereotype. I was in Korca & Pogradec, and mind you people weren't short there.
The Arvanites are also mainly Tosk descended, and when Pouquoville visited Greece, he noticed that they were taller and more muscular than their Greek neighbours, averaging 1,70cm (quite tall for those days when all people were at an average shorter). Perhaps a key factor here is nutrition and way of life. The Tosk population was pastoral early on as well, and this way of life was better preserved by the Arvanites. Gradually, South Albania lost its clan structure and was very much agriculturalized. This probably meant a different diet.
In Northern Albania, however, people preserved their old diet. The pastoral way of life was to a large degree maintained, and this was also the case in Montenegro & Herzegovina, where people are reputedly very tall.
Forum Emperor!(Balkan Papa)
Posts: 5687
(8/7/07 4:51 pm)
Re: hmm
You have labs in the south and they are (according to what shpata wrote or researched perhaps, btw shpata if you are reading this feel free to come back if you want) originally from the north and there could be your source (you MD appear typical for Montegegro/N Albania/Hercegovina/Dalmatia).
_________
Less Balkanian Dogmatic Paranoia. More Rational Ancient Hellenic Wisdom.
Forum Emperor!(Balkan Papa)
Posts: 5688
(8/7/07 6:09 pm)
Re: hmm
Dijedon, do you honestly think that there is 0% posibility that any of us might not have the 'other' influence within our veins.
He could have influence that goes centuries ago and certainly any of us will not be sure that long ago, there could be families that moved and later adapted local customs while fully 'abandoning' memory of origins.
One thing sure about balkans is that not one of us can claim any so called pure tribal origins as people were moving and we all attest to this considering we mostly do not live in balkans.
_________
Less Balkanian Dogmatic Paranoia. More Rational Ancient Hellenic Wisdom.
..
Korcars do marry especially with Kolonjars, who are over 2 meter tall and very dinaric as I have seen...
Labs are pretty short, even thou I do think they descend from the area of Shkodra and Montenegro...
However the Montenegrian mountainers descend from the area of north montenegro and bosnia! So the Labs being from Montenegro doesn't automatically make them tall...
hmm
Kolonjars arent tall, their slightly above average. I would say that they are generally between 5'9 and 6 ft. tall. Many of them have that "short" and fat characteristic feature of south Albs.
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Dijedon Senior Moderator
Posts: 9989
(8/8/07 1:34 pm)
Re: hmm
Quote:Dijedon, do you honestly think that there is 0% posibility that any of us might not have the 'other' influence within our veins.
I never stated such a thing. I just think that it is far-fetched to assume Meltdown's ancestors must've come from the north to explain his stature. Alot behind all this is the diet, and it is well-known that all European populations have grown in stature in comparison to their fathers, grandfathers etc. The Dutch for instance were famous as being among the shortest people of Europe. Now they're the tallest. It has nothing to do with an influx of highlanders from the dinaric alps.
Quote: Kolonjars arent tall, their slightly above average. I would say that they are generally between 5'9 and 6 ft. tall. Many of them have that "short" and fat characteristic feature of south Albs.
If their average is at 6 ft, then they may very well be considered tall. Aleksandėr Dhima, an Albanian anthropologist, noted that the tallest in Albania were those of Northern Albania, Camėria & Kolonja.
Re: hmm
Meltdown you're not the only tall south albanian. My family is from south albania for at least 7 generations that i know of and the majority of us are tall. I'm pretty tall for a girl, 178 cm. Here in Canada, Im always the tallest girl in the class. My mom and most of my aunts (blood or not blood related) are the same height as me. My uncles are gigantic. The only short one in my family is my sister and my father is average height.
Re: hmm
I know a lot of Korcars here in the U.S. and 90-95% of them are taller then the average americans that you see here everyday...as a matter of fact they are even taller then the malsors here in MI...all my friends are over 2 meter tall....I don't know about what some of you are talking about, but the korcars are the tallest (and musculized) albanians I have seen in the US.
hmm
Im not pure Korcar. In fact, only a portion of my blood has its roots in Korca. My roots are from deeper and Epirus and Im mixed with the various populations of the region, from Greek to Vlach.
Most of my mixture is Kolonjar. My uncle says that I have a very Kolonjar face(soft and round). Plus some distant heritage from Narta, Vlore.
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